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JcMagpie

Make your osC better by Learning from the competition

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Posted (edited)
14 minutes ago, Smoky Barnable said:

I like the design of this one page checkout module for open cart. Also, I have seen some carts that use a modal popup for entering credit card info and confirming order as the final step. I like that idea.

https://dreamvention.myshopunity.com/302/d_quickcheckout/admin/index.php?route=extension/module/d_quickcheckout/editor

 

Yes I run open cart on another site, its still very cluttered with lots of separate boxes and stuff. Its a bit like some of the old one page add-ons for osC were all the pages have just been dumped into one long page!

Maybe I'm asking too much but I think it can be a lot cleaner. I spoke to UPs recently when having an issue with  delivery and they stated most of the info they are given is not required all they use is the post code and door number or name of site ( I know this only covers the UK sorry), they don't need or use email or phone number.

I'm sure we can find a happy middle ground 😊 with the best of both worlds.

Edited by JcMagpie

 

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Posted (edited)

For me I am testing a new shopping cart called clicshopping, it's easy to choose what you want display or not and customize it. Also, the subscription is a little bit different.
All system has a different approach to the funnel. That I know, it must clear and help the customer to finish this order.
If a customer wants to buy a product, 1 or 5 step it's not a problem if all his clear, simple to understand; Some website doesn't make this approach and the customer after is lost inside the funnel and stop the process.

Edited by burt
remove fork link


Regards
-----------------------------------------
Loïc

Contact me by skype for business
Contact me @gyakutsuki for an answer on the forum

Tuto for 2.4 :
- How to Display a new page with app
- How to make Header Tags under app APP
- How to make a
boostrap modal with external element
 

 

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Interesting, but your just using osC again aren't you?

ClicShopping\OM is a framework based on OsCommerce 2.4 (in part) utilizing new features in PHP v5.6 to improve the performance, security, and modularity of the codebase. Taking advantage of namespaces and autoloading, it is now even easier to add new features and extend existing features without the need to edit core source code files.
The base framework is located in the includes/ClicShopping directory:


 

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This could be an interesting update to make to the checkout process as well as most forms on osC.  It would help speed things up if the form could auto complete, most people have details already on there phone and many have them on PC's as well.

Google have a nice article on this subject and how to implement it.

"People hate filling out web forms, especially on mobile devices. They can be slow and frustrating to complete and often contain multi-page steps and validation issues. This leads to high user drop-off and frustration. To help make things easier for users, browsers have long been able to autocomplete fields on behalf of the user. Chrome took this a step further in 2011 by introducing Autofill, which fills in entire forms based on a user's Autofill profile. "

https://developers.google.com/web/updates/2015/06/checkout-faster-with-autofill

This shows an example of it being used on a phone. If we can include this with what has already been discuses as possible improvements we may just have a workable solution?

https://developers.google.com/web/updates/images/2015-06-05-checkout-faster-with-autofill/autofill-1.gif

 

image.thumb.png.5840b39686159f755458d2e2ad3d9e14.png

You can try it for your self by going to this test form on your mobile device.

https://greenido.github.io/Product-Site-101/form-cc-example.html


 

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Posted (edited)

Please don't confuse autofill with the operator picking from a list of previously used info. As you see from the demo the name is picked and all other filed autofill.

"Luckily, most modern browsers provide a nice and clever feature to help users entering those information. The feature, called Autofill, automatically finds relevant input fields and fills them out with the most appropriate information the user has entered in the past. Autofill drastically reduces user’s pain of typing on a software keyboard. "

From what I can tell all this requires is that we set up the forms properly

  • Use the correct Lables
  • Fit with the standard form structure
  • Annotate fields properly with autocomplete attribute

As per example.

<form method="post" id="usrForm">
      <fieldset>
        <legend>Contact Info</legend>
        <label for="frmNameA">Name</label>
        <input name="name" id="frmNameA" placeholder="Full name" required autocomplete="name">
        <label for="frmEmailA">Email</label>
        <input type="email" name="email" id="frmEmailA" placeholder="name@example.com" required autocomplete="email">
        <label for="frmEmailC">Confirm Email</label>
        <input type="email" name="emailC" id="frmEmailC" placeholder="name@example.com" required autocomplete="email">
        <label for="frmPhoneNumA">Phone</label>
        <input type="tel" name="phone" id="frmPhoneNumA" placeholder="+1-650-450-1212" required autocomplete="tel">

        <datalist id="chocType">
          <option value="white">
            <option value="milk">
              <option value="dark"></datalist>
            </fieldset>
            <fieldset>
              <legend>Shipping</legend>
              <label for="frmAddressS">Address</label>
              <input name="ship-address" required id="frmAddressS" placeholder="123 Any Street" autocomplete="shipping street-address">
              <label for="frmCityS">City</label>
              <input name="ship-city" required id="frmCityS" placeholder="New York" autocomplete="shipping address-level2">
              <label for="frmStateS">State</label>
              <input name="ship-state" required id="frmStateS" placeholder="NY" autocomplete="shipping address-level1">
              <label for="frmZipS">Zip</label>
              <input name="ship-zip" required id="frmZipS" placeholder="10011" autocomplete="shipping postal-code">
              <label for="frmCountryS">Country</label>
              <input name="ship-country" required id="frmCountryS" placeholder="USA" autocomplete="shipping country">

              <label>
                <input type="checkbox" name="billAndShip" id="cbBillAndShip">
                <br>Bill to this address.</label>
            </fieldset>
            <fieldset>
              <legend>Billing</legend>
              <label for="frmAddressB">Address</label>
              <input name="bill-address" id="frmAddressB" required placeholder="123 Any Street" autocomplete="billing street-address">
              <label for="frmCityB">City</label>
              <input name="bill-city" id="frmCityB" required placeholder="New York" autocomplete="billing address-level2">
              <label for="frmStateB">State</label>
              <input name="bill-state" id="frmStateB" required placeholder="NY" autocomplete="billing address-level1">
              <label for="frmZipB">Zip</label>
              <input name="bill-zip" id="frmZipB" required placeholder="10011" autocomplete="billing postal-code">
              <label for="frmCountryB">Country</label>
              <input name="bill-country" id="frmCountryB" required placeholder="USA" autocomplete="billing country"></fieldset>

            <div id="paymentSec">
              <fieldset>
                <legend>Payment</legend>
                <p>
                  Do <b>NOT</b>
                  provide real credit card information in this field.
                </p>
                <label for="frmNameCC">Name on card</label>
                <input name="ccname" id="frmNameCC" required placeholder="Full Name" autocomplete="cc-name">
                <label for="frmCCNum">Card Number</label>
                <input name="cardnumber" id="frmCCNum" required autocomplete="cc-number">
                <label for="frmCCCVC">CVC</label>
                <input name="cvc" id="frmCCCVC" required autocomplete="cc-csc">
                <label for="frmCCExp">Expiry</label>
                <input name="cc-exp" id="frmCCExp" required placeholder="MM-YYYY" autocomplete="cc-exp">
                <div>
                  <button class="btn" id="butCheckout">Check Out</button>
                </div>
              </fieldset>
            </div>
          </form>
Edited by JcMagpie

 

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On 8/14/2018 at 6:40 PM, Gyakutsuki said:

For me I am testing a new shopping cart called clicshopping, it's easy to choose what you want display or not and customize it. Also, the subscription is a little bit different.
All system has a different approach to the funnel. That I know, it must clear and help the customer to finish this order.
If a customer wants to buy a product, 1 or 5 step it's not a problem if all his clear, simple to understand; Some website doesn't make this approach and the customer after is lost inside the funnel and stop the process.

Pretty shit that you have not respected copyright.  


This is a signature that appears on all my posts.  
IF YOU MAKE A POST REQUESTING HELP...please state the exact version
of osCommerce that you are using. THANKS

 
Get the latest current code (community-supported responsive 2.3.4.1BS Edge) here

 

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4 hours ago, JcMagpie said:

This could be an interesting update to make to the checkout process as well as most forms on osC.  It would help speed things up if the form could auto complete, most people have details already on there phone and many have them on PC's as well.

Discussion on this a while back; 

 

It seems as though I abandoned it, though cannot recall why 😕 


This is a signature that appears on all my posts.  
IF YOU MAKE A POST REQUESTING HELP...please state the exact version
of osCommerce that you are using. THANKS

 
Get the latest current code (community-supported responsive 2.3.4.1BS Edge) here

 

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😊 Ok that's good maybe we can pick up from where you left off, will probably save a lot of time, @raiwa has kindly offered to look at updating his add-on to see if it can include some of the ideas to streamline checkout I'm sure the code will make more sense to him than me.

 


 

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Decided to take a further look at what the competition are doing to make it easy to for customer. I’ve already looked at checkout so decided to look at the front end. How easy is it to sign up and make an account? Well the results were quite surprising.

It looks as if osC is out of step with many of the market leaders. Put simply our first look for the customer is very off putting compared to most others.

 

Lets just have a look.

 

Shopify

image.png.969e7033d49bb8e733ecc18c0826d067.png

 

Magento

image.png.a75f89d10a177dddc9c1e3e9c33894db.png

 

WooCommerce

image.png.43c4986eb39d60bd228ba6ce460955b8.png

 

OpenCart

image.png.54cebd422b5a51b8093004b5048abd16.png

 

osCommerce

image.png.4098118d321b3b26d41470291413a27d.png

 

I think anyone looking at these would see that our create account page is clearly out of step and could be seen as very off putting!

Do we really need all that info up front! I think the competitors have clearly seen the need to make the first contact the customer has as low key as possible.

Woocommerce have taken this a step further and removed the create account all together from the front page. You just shop and go to check out and then you are simply given a simple tick box if you want to make an account.

image.png.e9fc55d0f4b08a5a4ff4e21848a4f56d.png

 

I think it's clear from this that we have to update our create account process as it could be off putting to new customers. We could just do what Wooo do and get rid of it from index and just make it a simple selection option on the check out page.

I think that combined with the ideas for streamlining the checkout could make osC a much better experience for customers.


 

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Whether your point is valid or not there appears to be no development on osC. After dropping in for a few posts the person in charge has disappeared again, so how would any proposed changes be incorporated into the software?


Let's make things easier for new osCommerce users http://forums.oscommerce.com/topic/402638-discussion-about-hard-coded-database-tables/?p=1718900  Getting there with osCommerce 2.4! :thumbsup:

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Posted (edited)

As long as the people using it care that’s all that matters. Development may be slow and on an as required basis but it will continue. I personally don’t have a problem with Harold popping in as and when he is able. 😊 Will hopfully be looking at the checkout process in due course with the help of a kind developer.

I intend to do what I can as and when time allows. Anyone else can do the same or not, after all there is no compulsion to be involved its all voluntary.

The ideas are still relevant even to your new project.😊

These are just ideas some may work other may fall by the wayside but at least we can discuss the pros and cons.

Much of the work required has already been done on older versions. There are many add-on’s for checkout without account, some good some not so good.

Hopefully with the new modular checkout making the required changes will be simpler. No harm in trying.

Edited by JcMagpie

 

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Personally I don't think the create account page as it stands is that bad - the only difference between osC and those other ones is the size and location of the asterisk ?

And i have never been keen on guest checkout type mods.

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1 minute ago, JcMagpie said:

As long as the people using it care that’s all that matters. Development may be slow and on an as required basis but it will continue. I personally don’t have a problem with Harold popping in as and when he is able. 😊 Will hopfully be looking at the checkout process in due course with the help of a kind developer.

I intend to do what I can as and when time allows. Anyone else can do the same or not, after all there is no compulsion to be involved its all voluntary.

The ideas are still relevant even to your new project.😊

We have been waiting for years for the official oscommerce to be responsive. It hasn't happened, and you have critisised myself and others for running oscommerce down. We have all been here waiting for the promised changes to happen. What makes you think that something will happen in the next years to change the create account page.

What you could, and should do is to create an addon that replaces the current pages and system, then others could use it on the official or BS versions if they wished. If you cant change the core code, change what people use by creating addons. If the first install instruction was to rename all the current files, uploading the new ones would be easy.

Its great people making suggestions on how things could be improved, but you have to remember that no one here can make changes to the official version as you have heard many times. The only real way to make changes is through the addons area.


REMEMBER BACKUP, BACKUP AND BACKUP

Before installing the official version of oscommerce first look at a responsive version here

It's very easy to over complicate what are simple things in life

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Posted (edited)
54 minutes ago, 14steve14 said:

We have been waiting for years for the official oscommerce to be responsive. It hasn't happened, and you have critisised myself and others for running oscommerce down. We have all been here waiting for the promised changes to happen. What makes you think that something will happen in the next years to change the create account page.

What you could, and should do is to create an addon that replaces the current pages and system, then others could use it on the official or BS versions if they wished. If you cant change the core code, change what people use by creating addons. If the first install instruction was to rename all the current files, uploading the new ones would be easy.

Its great people making suggestions on how things could be improved, but you have to remember that no one here can make changes to the official version as you have heard many times. The only real way to make changes is through the addons area.

Please if you have nothing constructive to add to the subject of this thread then go open your own. I am not interested in going over the same old political nonsense that has taken place on several threads before.

We are simply discussing ways to improve the offering. If you care to read the full thread you will see a way forward has already been discussed and an offer to help look at this proposal made and accepted.

As and when the work is done it will be posted on the forum.

 

Edited by JcMagpie

 

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Well stop trying to change something that cant be changed. This is a public forum and everyone of us here, and some have been here a lot longer than some, have a right to keep pointing out the obvious when people seem to take no notice of what is being said. All these pointless comparisons should also be removed as they serve no purpose. They are just your opinion which you seem to want to freely voice but others cant voice theirs. But never mind as lo g as your ooinion matters and no one elses does.

As i said if you want to change something create an addon and do it that way. No matter what you keep on about it will not change the official version. If it could then this whole post would have a point. 


REMEMBER BACKUP, BACKUP AND BACKUP

Before installing the official version of oscommerce first look at a responsive version here

It's very easy to over complicate what are simple things in life

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Posted (edited)
2 hours ago, 14steve14 said:

Well stop trying to change something that cant be changed.

Just in case you missed the first 2 times you were told, A kind developer has already agreed to look at updating one of his add-on to include some of the ideas here.

As the rules of the forum do not allow me to discuses commercial work here I’m not able to. However the discussion is taking place in PM and I’m sure if he decides to discus it in public he will after all that’s his decision.

So hopefully that answers your questions.

Anything can be changed as long as you have the will to do it. Just chill out and let those who chose to, get one with it. Peace and love man! 😊

 

Edited by JcMagpie

 

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Cool ideas. I like the idea of a simplified create account method. A pop up modal box to create account would be nice.


The water in a vessel is sparkling; the water in the sea is dark. The small truth has words which are clear; the great truth has great silence.

- Rabindranath Tagore

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Once again, this thread has devolved into a bunch of semi-related topics, all being discussed (argued?) in a random fashion. Let's see if we can bring this together (somewhat). As I see it, the initial issue has expanded to now include:

 

1) Guest checkout,

2) One page checkout -vs- multi page, and

3) What information is required in order to create an account.

 

So, let's take these one at a time ...

1) Out-of-the-box, osC requires a customer to create an account. There is one very popular add-on (and a number of less popular ones, although most of them probably have not been updated to the latest code base) that adds the Guest Checkout functionality to osC. I use it in my store. It's strange ... I have repeat customers that still prefer to use the Guest Checkout. When one boils it all down, the only thing between a guest checkout and a registered customer is a password. So be it; give them what they want.

However, consider what a Guest Checkout *doesn't* have ... Without an account (ie: password), the customer can't check on the status of their order, nor review their purchase history, leave reviews or testimonials, etc. (yes, I acknowledge that there is a commercial module available to allow some of that). If a customer is only ever going to make that one purchase, than these things may not be important. But, if there's a problem with the order I places in your shop as a guest, how can  I follow up on it? And, maybe we, as store owners, need to emphasize better the benefits of having an account.

2) This has been discussed here many times. Do you want one LONG checkout page, or a couple of shorter ones? *IF* the customer enters the checkout process, and has no idea where they are, that's bad. On the other hand, *IF* it is clearly shown where the customer is in the checkout process, and what's left to do, a couple of smaller pages are fine (IMHO). I also think that using popup Modals in an effort to reduce the page length is a bad idea, especially if the customer is on a mobile device.

3) Out-of-the-box, to create an account, osC requires the customer's gender and date-of-birth. These are easily turned off in Admin (I do in my stores), and should not be a consideration in what information is needed to create an account.

The other main thing that osC asks for is the customer's address (we'll set aside the newsletter sign-up for now). So, if I create an account without having to enter an address, I'll have to enter it when I place an order (see #2 above). And, if I place more than one order through the shop, having to enter my address with each order hasn't saved me any time, has it?

The point is, you're going to have to ask for the customer's address somewhere in the relationship. Do you ask up front, or later on?

 

If one wishes to explore yet another option, consider this: Your customer comes into your shop, puts something into their cart, and starts the checkout process. There is only one checkout process. Don't even bother saying, "If you have an account, please log in." The first thing asked for is the customer's email address. Your store checks to see if that email address is associated with an account. If it is, a Modal pops up saying, "Welcome back, <first name>. Please enter your password", logs the customer in, and pre-fills the checkout form. If the email address is not associated with an account, the 'guest' checkout process continues with the customer filling out things as they go. At the very end, after the order is finalized, the (still 'guest') customer is now asked if they want to create an account. All of the benefits are explained, and the customer only has to enter a password. If none is entered, no account is created.

To expand this idea further  ... if when the customer enters their email address, and there is no account associated with that email address, but there are prior orders (as guests) linked to the email address, your shop could acknowledge the prior orders, re-emphasize the benefits of an account, and ask again if they want to create an account.

 

The bottom line is ... there is no one right answer. As store owners, we can tailor our shops to what our customers want (or, at lease, what we think they want). Since osC is open source, we are free to change anything we want. And, with all the development work being done to make it more modular, these changes are becoming easier to make.

(we return you to your regularly scheduled bickering)


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1 hour ago, ArtcoInc said:

I have repeat customers that still prefer to use the Guest Checkout.

I have that request time and time again. I looked at a couple of option for existing add-on’s but decided to review what the other carts were doing before deciding to make changes. The results of the review showed that it was probably best to make some changes as I prefer the woocommerce approach. Just my preference nothing more.

Neither approach is right or wrong! just different. Having looked at the checkout I decided to look at the front end also to see how well they could be integrated.

I don’t see why simply reviewing and looking at options to improve an existing, or make a new add-on can generate so much resistance! 😊 just be happy that we may be able to have another add-on that some may find usefull.

I don’t mind where the ideas come from as long as they contribute to try and make the osC experience better. So if you have one that can help please post here.


 

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Posted (edited)
On 8/15/2018 at 9:55 PM, burt said:

It seems as though I abandoned it, though cannot recall why 😕 

Well just tested @burts autofill code on test site and on android using chrome it worked perfectly 😊  the auto fill required me to only type the first letter of my first name and it completed the rest of the form automaticly. There are some filed not beeing completed like Suburb but that could just be me! I'll have to check the code to make sure I did not miss a change.  I have never goten into the checkout or account side of the code so can not comment on what else may or may not need looking into. I will try the rest of the changes you made and see how they go but so far looking good.

It can be tested on the test site https://www.justfastfood.com/create_account.php

Edited by JcMagpie

 

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Working fine on Chrome both on PC and phones, took 5-10 seconds to make new account with autofill 😊. Unable to make it work on Firefox for now, must be an issue with firefox settings it just defaults to autocomplete giving you an option in each field.


 

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So with Auto-fill working striped down the account registration to the bare minimum. It works fine but I think will require quite a bit more work to integrate with check out, something outside my comfort zone and best left to someone who knows the code.

It could take two routes both add-on’s.

a) Be totally independent of stock account and checkout and work along side it.

b) Link into the current account and checkout, this will need to resolve how and at which point they overlap? Not as easy as it first looks.

image.png.840158e3b525e1cc32882e7978dd8fda.png


 

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Posted (edited)

Something related to this topic,

Over the last few weeks I've been having a few customers complaining about the PayPal checkout not working properly. About 2-3 per week all similar issues about not seeing the PayPal page properly on there devices. One customer sent me a image showing this odd behavior, As you can see the bottom of the page is missing preventing the customer from continuing.

image.png.f9cc99fb24c87855aa07d2f79545ddc9.png

As you can imagine after trying a few times the customer just got frustrated and gave up! Luckily the customer rang to complain so I got to know about the problem. Most of the others were in abandoned carts and on emailing a number of them confirmed PayPal problems also.

I contacted PayPal to check what was wrong. I never got a clear answer to why it could be happening, but I did get a solution which may help others.

Now I use PayPal express so this may only relate to this.

image.png.55d07288615cc1f34fbb99eb454774f0.png

There was a setting in the Paypal config that I could change. Switched from Clasic to In-Context.

image.thumb.png.8159f74778696312947b28cd3f405481.png

This replaces the normal PayPal check out page with a small modal popup page which behaves better on devices. So far not had any further issues.

image.png.a568f65655f7a724ef192abfbf114c21.png

Edited by JcMagpie

 

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Posted (edited)

For those who are using PayPal express you will have realised that it allows for Guest Check out that works really well. However nothing tells the customer this is an option unless they actually select the PayPal express button. I wonder how many customer simply look for guest check out and not seeing the option just abandon the cart!

A simple fix for this is to simple add an instruction telling them it’s an option. For now its a simple code edit.

In public_html/shopping_cart.php go to around line 146 find,

<p class="text-right"><?php echo TEXT_ALTERNATIVE_CHECKOUT_METHODS; ?></p>

immediately below that add this.

<div class="clearfix"></div>
  <b><font color="blue"><p class="text-right"><?php echo "For Guest Checkout Use PayPal Express"; ?></b></font></p>

This has been tested on CE with PayPal express only.

It’s a short term fix for now. 😊

 

image.thumb.png.9301a97a65930188057898144daf7da9.png

Edited by JcMagpie

 

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Posted (edited)

Making progress slowly as time permits, separate Modal Accounts navbar added to test site. Would be helpful if people could test it on different devices to see how it looks/works.

 

Auto fill should work and pages should be modal’s. It’s work in progress so may be some glitches. Needs a lot more work to integrate checkout and other pages. Not as simple as it first looks🙄

Odd thing is modal works fine on mobile devices but on PC is proving difficult auto resize to fit responsive CE!

Can be tested here https://www.justfastfood.com/

image.thumb.png.3b4153365ee441b9f68c401ec566a1ad.png

Edited by JcMagpie

 

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